Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

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Discussion of general topics related to the new release and its place in the world. Don't discuss new features, report bugs, ask for support, et cetera. Don't use this to spam for other boards or attack those boards!
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TwistedWeather
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by TwistedWeather »

ScionCrow wrote: Let's see here.. vB vs. phpBB topics don't go too well, they just create spamfests..

I've been a member of phpBB.com for two years before I quit. It's not because I hate phpBB (I still love it actually), but it's because of the users flaming everyone.. (not all, but... the ones I came accross......... ick..)

I've personally tried vB out, and I was very unimpressed with it. I couldn't figure out the Admin Panel very well, it was all disorganized, and it just didn't run that well at all. It's also packed with features that I do not need, karma being one of them. It's a great addition, but it shouldn't be part of the core code. Other than that, I couldn't figure out vB in general anyway, so I quickly stopped using it and stayed with phpBB as it was.

That's.... what I have to say...
My gripe with VB is it's looks/style besides it's awful price. Heck i would rather go with IPB but even there once the new phpbb 3 is out they wont have nothing special that cant be found here as well. Basically i am in limbo till the new release is out in beta. The current phpbb2 is far to outdated. Right now i sit with a older IPB and a smf till the new phpbb 3 is released because this has what i want with this new release plus a few extras that none of the rest have.
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naderman
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by naderman »

This was a topic about a hook system so let's not make this a board x is better topic (Read the forum rules!)
DragonlordP
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by DragonlordP »

Mark The Daemon wrote: Lets be honest about this. MOD installation is not hard. Follow the instructions exactly how is says in the text and then you will be fine. If you still find that hard then some nice people have grouped together and created EasyMOD for you all to use. A lot of the MODs currently available for phpBB are EM complient and therefore you shouldn't have a problem. If you do then there are dedicated support boards here to help you overcome this. Why create a whole new system when all it takes is to upload a few files and run one install. Personally i think the developers time is better spend developing bigger and better features that the whole community will use, not just a selection.


Mark
OK, a both manual and automatic system would be the best, but even with an automatic only you can find the differences. You can backup the files that will be affected and the compare them with a problem... sure isn't big trouble, is it? I am NOT interested in php, I'm sure most of the rest of the people using phpbb aren't, we just want a good, reliable and easy to work with forum engine. A hook system would be great for those who just don't want to spare any time in php tweaking, and all the programmers can still spot the differences in code as I described above.

I'd also prefer it if the mods were more "official" than "everyone post your own mod". I mean that should still be the general idea, but then mods would be overviewed by someone so that there is the least possible interfering with other mods - and maybe we could have a list of which mod works with which and which doesn't... I know it's not gonna happen, but it's on topic.
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mant3ra
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by mant3ra »

ok like 1st i didnt start this thread like duel phpbb vs. vb
this is sugestiona and i think this is grate stuff...couse i have used vB board for 2y and i have read that mambo have the same thing...i just compare vb couse i saw that system there...
Like somepopel sayd here they hate hook system couse they want to control theyr installed hacks....
U can easy edit .xml file and edit code...but instead for changing codes in php file u can hook code..so it will work the same like u did install that hack editing code..

Ok i have send some images hows that working couse im not surre that people know hows that looks:

Plugin system:
Image:
Image

This is edit option: (u havre more option like Disable/Export/Unistall )
Image:
Image

And this is code which is in .xml file:

Code: Select all

// Update older Version
if ($installed_version === null)
{
	// New Install or Upgrade from Pre-RC1
	$db->query("DELETE FROM " . TABLE_PREFIX . "setting WHERE varname = 'welcomepmuserid'");
	$db->query("UPDATE " . TABLE_PREFIX . "phrase SET languageid=-1, product='welcomepm' WHERE languageid=0 AND varname IN ('setting_welcomepmuserid_desc', 'setting_welcomepmuserid_title', 'welcomepm')");
	$rebuild = array(
			'plugins' => true,
			'phrases' => true,
			'options' => true
	);
}
So instead editing includes/class_core.php or what ever u just hook that code in this way.
So i have used beta ver of phpbb3 (olympus) and i saw loads new options and its much easy and freandly board then phpbb2 is...
So if somebody make hook system for phpbb it will be the best board around..

See ya and i hope mail coders of phpbb will have this in maind. Couse as last man sayd he is not interested in php and many people dont know whats is php and the old (editing) way of installing mods are to hard and take much time.

So i sugest main coders to try oud demo of vb 3.5.x and find out hows that look...and i know what they gona love it :p

And i can say i like phpbb much more then any other board .... see ya and good work !
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Mark The Daemon
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by Mark The Daemon »

DragonlordP wrote:
Mark The Daemon wrote: Lets be honest about this. MOD installation is not hard. Follow the instructions exactly how is says in the text and then you will be fine. If you still find that hard then some nice people have grouped together and created EasyMOD for you all to use. A lot of the MODs currently available for phpBB are EM complient and therefore you shouldn't have a problem. If you do then there are dedicated support boards here to help you overcome this. Why create a whole new system when all it takes is to upload a few files and run one install. Personally i think the developers time is better spend developing bigger and better features that the whole community will use, not just a selection.


Mark
OK, a both manual and automatic system would be the best, but even with an automatic only you can find the differences. You can backup the files that will be affected and the compare them with a problem... sure isn't big trouble, is it? I am NOT interested in php, I'm sure most of the rest of the people using phpbb aren't, we just want a good, reliable and easy to work with forum engine. A hook system would be great for those who just don't want to spare any time in php tweaking, and all the programmers can still spot the differences in code as I described above.

I'd also prefer it if the mods were more "official" than "everyone post your own mod". I mean that should still be the general idea, but then mods would be overviewed by someone so that there is the least possible interfering with other mods - and maybe we could have a list of which mod works with which and which doesn't... I know it's not gonna happen, but it's on topic.
Thats the whole point of the MODDB...people submit MODs and then they get vailidated by the MOD team. If only the MOD team were allowed to make official mods there wouldn't be 1/8th of the amount of MODs currently in the MODDB and also MOD in Developments...which means you are restricting the users....which is turning phpBB more like vB IMO...


Mark
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They just make crappy programs..."
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smithy_dll
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by smithy_dll »

If you think you can run a large phpBB forum and expect to not be able to use PHP, then you are sadly mistaken.

You can however, run a small forum with no more than a dozen active users and not know what you are doing. But, you still need to be on the ball with updates to the core package!

The facts:
phpBB3 will not be getting a hooks system.
The MODDB are validated MODs which have been tested by the phpBB MOD Team. These MODs have been checked for security, and have been installed and tested for functionality on a brand new phpBB forum.
Nothing can be guaranteed to always work (The MOD Team has limited resources to test each MOD)
Nothing connected to the internet can be guaranteed to 100% secure, so it takes work to maintain a forum.

There are things that can be done to take some of the load off forum owner, but there is no substituite for the forum owner keeping their board up-to-date and maintained. There is only so much which can be automated.

There are unique challenges regarding modifying phpBB, specifically it's open-source nature. This means it's much more likely two code modifications will clash with eachother. There are coding techniques which can minimise this, but there is also going too far and sacrificing any kind of performance for making it easier for a few people to install code modifications.
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phpBB, its open source, become involved, write a modification!
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multigl
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by multigl »

If anyone is interested, I've developed an object oriented hook system for phpbb 2.0.x because I got really frustrated with having to re-write in all of my mods. I'd definitely need to clean it up to bring it up to the sexy level of phpbb code, but I don't mind sharing. Though my forums are down for large maintenance at the moment, I used the hook object to implement thread rating, a WYSIWYG editor, and a file manager.
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itsonlybarney
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by itsonlybarney »

A hook system would certainly be very helpful, especially for the very large MODs that some people create.

BUT I don't necessarily think that it SHOULD be included in every installation because not all people want to add MODs to their forum. phpBB is forum software and that is the way it currently is.

If I want to add a MOD I want to install it myself so that I can learn how things work, and why they work.

Fair enough some poeple don't want to go through that hassle but there has to be a line somewhere. The phpBB team have chosen not to include the hook system because they didn't feel that it was necessary. We have to live with that decision.

BTW no one is stopping you from creating a MOD that adds the hook system functionality to your forum. But you will then have to create your own MODs to work with that system.
mant3ra
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by mant3ra »

ok..but i dont know that u andersted me well...
Couse hook system works like ordinery php code..instead editing php file in ur root/forum dir.u can just easy hook - fatch that code just like ur edited nesesery file...

And i see that u saying that phpbb have some security problems. but im not surre why..
this is code hows look in .xml file and hows code fatch php codes:

This is hows looking findl *xml code which is redy for hook (this im only sending for main php coders of phpbb and i hope they gona see that is not that diferent from writing ordinery php code for phpbb for which we gona need 30min and 20 files to install it and much more to unistall )



So since u dont wand to make hook system i sugest u to make some way to install hacks in easy way then corently is...

Couse like in vB instead editing php files u can only edit template which is cashed in mysql (or any other database system)
Last edited by Anon on Thu May 18, 2006 7:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Removed vB code that's against their license
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Acyd Burn
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Re: Sugestion - Hook system like on vB 3.5

Post by Acyd Burn »

I think some are confusing a plugin/event system and an installer/code changer. SMF for example does not have a real plugin system but rather having a very trimmed down version of easymod (it is the same approach though they are using very plain xml files) and changing the files on the system. A plugin system is not changing files, the code is meant to hook into pre-defined code locations to change or overwrite/inherit existing methods/code or add to it.

For 3.2 (previously 3.0.x) an event system is planned and already mostly finished (it has been done by naderman and DavidMJ as a community coding project). But this system is using hooks within the code and is not meant as supporting MOD installations or similar things - it is meant for admins to create automatic events (do this and this if this and this is true).

If a real plugin system (not changing code) for mods or a package manager (changing code) is integrated within the next version highly depends on how MODX develops and once the more in-depth planning for 3.2 started.

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