Is there a God, and is He Good?

[BMWGuy]

I certainly don't intend to start a war here, but being an innately philosophical person that I am, I'd be curious too see how this thread turms out. My question:

Is there a God, why or why not (if you can think of something), and is He "Good"?

Thanks...

[BartVB]

According to me there isn't. I've been brought up catholic (well, I went to a catholic school) but my 'faith' in God has always been very thin. It completely dissapeared when my grandmother died in a horrible (painful, humiliating, prolonged) way of cancer. My grandmother was very faithful to her 'god', she praid, went to church, tried hard to live a good life and then her life ended in such a way. At that moment (I was 10 or 11 years old) my ability to believe in god completely disappeared.

In the years after that I gained more knowledge and now I'm completely convinced that there is not a god. Just read some stuff about history and how religions have been created by 'the powers that be' (read: the rulers) to get control over 'the people'. They did that _really_ well, I'm very impressed by that, but IMO it has absolutely nothing to do with a higher power.

I'm sure that there is more to the world than what we know now, Reiki, energy fields, etc, etc do exist to some extend IMO. And maybe there even is a higher power or something like that. But definately _not_ in the form of 'God' and I certainly do not believe in Jesus. Actually I find it hard to accept that there are people with a scientific background that believe in a god like it's described in the bible.

But indoctrination (it has a negative ring to it, I know, I'm sorry but I don't have a better term for it) is a _very_ powerful tool. Especially if your complete environment is convinced that 'The Bible' is the book of truth and that the minister is always right. If people believe in a God then that's completely fine with me, just as long as they don't expect me to join in their joy and as long as they don't use bible related arguments in discussions

[BMWGuy]

So you are more Atheistic than Agnostic, correct? Good, good, one opinion.............anyone else? After that, I will explain my personal opinion.

BTW: This thread is obvieously open to people of all beliefs....................even if you seriously believe you pet rock is actually your god. Of, course, please refrain from posting that if you really aren't being serious.

[Roberdin]

My pet rock is my G...

Of, course, please refrain from posting that if you really aren't being serious.

D'oh.

Seriously, I'm not really sure. However, I have had the opportuntity to see some of the most impressive cathedrals in Europe, and you can't help thinking that 'this can't have all just been invented'...

[BMWGuy]

Well, there so many religions out there that build extremely expensive shrines, churches, etc. to honor their God, but we know that not every religion can be true at the same time. Many religions require you to beilve things that directly contradict a required beilf of a different religion. Hence, it is impossible for all religions to be true.

[BartVB]

Hmm, I'm an atheistic agnosticus

I do think that we just can't know if there is (or is not) a god. But I'm strongly on the 'is not' side

BTW before you start thinking that I'l all weird I (vaguely) know 2 people (younger than 60) that go to church approximately once a week. There are maybe 2 or 3 that do believe in a god but don't go to church but the rest of the people that I know (and the majority of people in The Netherlands) just don't believe in a god. BTW this is quite a change from, say, 50 years ago. At that time almost everyone was religious.

[olger901]

Heh I am from the Netherlands, and I was born catholic however I never go to church (the last time I went was I think 4 years ago or something like it for a wedding) and I don't believe in god either.

[nicopaul]

I've been brought up to believe in God and have lived in a catholic house where we celebrate Christmas and all other religious holidays. My family does go to church every now and then, but I do not join them. I know that the two smartest people ever to have graced this planet have concluded that for space to have begun, was an act of God and unexplainably anything else. Also, I've heard stories which make you sure one exists. But I am of an extremely mathematical and scientific brain type and need pure cold evidence before basing my entire belief system on anything.

I do, however live my life as a hard-working respectful citizen and abide by the law, but not because I want to go to Heaven (mind you, if it does exist I'd rather go there than Hell) but rather because I want to be a good person and help contribute to this planet. Anyways, just my opinion, and I'm sure there are millions of others who feel differently in other ways.

nico

[BMWGuy]

I've been a Christian since I was six, I actively attend church (non-denominational, Christian) one sunday----mind you, unlike other religions, I do not go to church because I feel it merits me any saving-favor with God.

I feel that going to church, the sacraments, and living a good life are the joyfull duties of a Christian, but they, in and of themkselves, do not save anyone.

I believe that the only source for truth concerning God is found in the unadulterated Bible, alone. And, the Bible should only be interpreted by other portions of the Bible---not by famous people, or popes, or even pastors. The Bible is the final authority.

I further believe that we are saved not by any good works that we do, but rather, we are saved only by the being granted Grace (by God) to have the faith to believe all that is neccessary to be saved.

God is perfectly good in all that he does. Things that, to us, look bad, are really actually (in some way that is too trancendent for us to comprehend), actually a good thing and not a bad thing. I believe that from the moment we commited our first wrong-doing, we are fully deserving of everything bad ("hell", as some might call it). But, God has, for reasons only known to him, decided to show his mercy on all of us.

I believe that God is also; however, perfectly Just and righteous. He will not allow his perfect mercy to get in the way of his perfect justice. He simply allows us to experience that natural results of our wrong doings----namely, bad things that happen.

I feel that regardless what you believe about God, you really cannot deny the exsistentance of at least some form of supernatural power.

just my humble opinions.....I'm still very much up to hearing and listening to other's views..

[Roberdin]

I believe that the only source for truth concerning God is found in the unadulterated Bible, alone. And, the Bible should only be interpreted by other portions of the Bible---not by famous people, or popes, or even pastors. The Bible is the final authority.

What about the parts where the bible contradicts itself?

and would you consider it, for example, wrong, in WW2, that we did not turn the other cheek on behalf of Continental Europe and the ethnic minorities/Jews, but we instead declared war on them, a major violation of God's will?


I'm not trying to disparage your beliefs here, but I consider the Bible to be diviniely inspired, but no more. It was written in the context of the Roman Empire by men who could not possibly have understood concepts such as the 'Big Bang' or the existence of the universe as a single 'membrane' among many - the latter is a very recent theory, in fact.

I think that what is important, like in any book or novel, is not the literal context - especially after three or four translations from Hewbrew > Latin > Old English > 'New'/Victorian English - but the underlying implications and meanings.