07: Watch your Languages

[-=ET=-]

Actually, I believe that although Chinese is the most common first language, english is more common with first and second language combined.

Sure but that's not really the problem.

These REAL figures from UN were just here to illustrate the fact that English is not an universal language in the world. You 2 seems to live in the USA but do not imagine that even in Europe many people "really" speak English enough to work with it and write MODs.
And if you've been once in Asia in your life you should know that very few people speak English there, even in second language. There is some business people, some tourist industry workers and that's quite all

But the problem is not there.
EM need to support multiple MOD templates as the exotic ones you can find on phpBBHacks for example and trying to impose phpBB English instructions is not a good choice for EM IMO.
This will make that many users and developpers will not use it.

[Bananeweizen]

You're MOD adicted?

Nope. Most of the MODs on my board are functional enhancements instead of funky (nice to have) things. I made my own CMS, a user computer database, a user location map and some other MODs which are more closely related to the main topic of my web site (Distributed Computing).

If people are able to write the commands in their own language they will use even more variations of each command.

That should not be a problem.
Once again, read this topic and especialy this post...
http://area51.phpbb.com/phpBB22/viewtop ... 9224#79224

I did read that. And again for clarification: In that thread German action translations are given. If I were allowed to use German actions, I would use at least 5 other action names which are more suited to my mind. And other people will use other translations again. I really doubt that all those (possible) translations will find their way into EM.

English is the 2nd language in the world before Chinese which with the only Mandarin is spoken by 2 time more persons than English (nearly 1 billion against less than 500 millions for English, on more than 6 billions persons on earth).

Well. That's not really the point I'm trying to explain. We could also do all MODs in Chinese if you prefer. I only want to point out that a single MOD format will be easier to handle (and to my mind the only way to handle MODs automatically by computer applications). Or did you ever see anybody translate the entity names of an XML DTD to his own language?

EM need to support multiple MOD templates as the exotic ones you can find on phpBBHacks for example and trying to impose phpBB English instructions is not a good choice for EM IMO.
This will make that many users and developpers will not use it.

If a MOD developer is not using English for his MODs then it is not because he doesn't understand English but because he does not want to use English. He couldn't even write a MOD if he were not able to understand the English code.
(I guess that this is especially true for our French MODders )
And a MOD user doesn't need to understand the MOD source because he should be using EM, which will do all the necessary things for him (with a translated control panel, but not necessarily a translated MOD template).

Just as an example: I require the users of my MODs to use EasyMOD and do explicitly not support manual installations. Since I introduced that requirement into my MODs, all my life (and that of my users) has become much easier with the number of wrong installations dropping to zero and people only asking for new features instead of installation support.

Ciao, Michael.

[-=ET=-]

I did read that. And again for clarification: In that thread German action translations are given. If I were allowed to use German actions, I would use at least 5 other action names which are more suited to my mind. And other people will use other translations again. I really doubt that all those (possible) translations will find their way into EM.

That's why I ask for a clarification from Nuttzy but normally there will not have only 1 official translation by language. You will have the possibility to give your own (personal/even exotic) MOD template with the MOD.
Like that EM will be able to support ANY MOD, even with any exotic template.

What you've seen on the 1st page of the topic is just Nuttzy asking for translations sample to do tests! Not a list of definitive officials translations.

Or did you ever see anybody translate the entity names of an XML DTD to his own language?

Nobody ask to translate php, that's not the question.

He couldn't even write a MOD if he were not able to understand the English code.
(I guess that this is especially true for our French MODders )

No that's wrong.
You can learn php which is a language with few codes to learn (it's not English even if it use some english words), without being fluent in English to understand the phpBB template, write the MOD title, the MOD description, the language entries, the authors notes, the comments, and so on...

Just as an example: I require the users of my MODs to use EasyMOD and do explicitly not support manual installations. Since I introduced that requirement into my MODs, all my life (and that of my users) has become much easier with the number of wrong installations dropping to zero and people only asking for new features instead of installation support.

lol!
I know some people who must choke readind what you said but Welcome to the club!

Niels for who I've adapted 30% of his MOD is doing the same.

I'm a fervent supporter of EM as you seem to be too.
Unfortunately my French EM support topic is not available anymore and I don't know if I can create one here (Nuttzy?) but personally I'll do the same since the beta1 is available.
Alpha release still needs too many explanations for SQL, languages entries, immediate un-installation if there is an error, and so on...

[GPHemsley]

Just as an example: I require the users of my MODs to use EasyMOD and do explicitly not support manual installations. Since I introduced that requirement into my MODs, all my life (and that of my users) has become much easier with the number of wrong installations dropping to zero and people only asking for new features instead of installation support.

That's a pretty good idea.

I know some people who must choke readind what you said but Welcome to the club!

Almost.

[Bananeweizen]

No that's wrong.

Well, I guess you missunderstood me. My note was not about the French people not understanding/speaking English but about often not wanting to speak English. I guess it's because they are so proud of their language.
BTW: That's only from my personal experience being completely ignored by French people when I asked for the way or other things using English language in Paris.

Ciao, Michael.

[-=ET=-]

Well, I guess you missunderstood me.

I understood you well but most people doesn't speak English as they can't.
Few French people speaks English compared to people of other European countries as northern ones for example. It's nearly the same in most latin countries.

[Ptirhiik]

To package a mod in a language or not is the choice of the author, not a feature of easymod (I really can't see how easymod would be able to translate a description or a title if not provided by the author).

Even if in some you can be comfuse by a language name regarding the country (I'm think ie of Dutch regarding German, as the german word is Deutch), this is rather a matter of culture and correct use of any www search engine.

[Nuttzy99]

FYI I'm just finishing some stuff up with BBCode Standards and then I will get back to discussing chapters 7 and 8.

Thanks,
-Nuttzy

[AlleyKat]

FYI I'm just finishing some stuff up with BBCode Standards and then I will get back to discussing chapters 7 and 8.

One happens to highly approve of this, as the entire MOD team seems to have accepted several MODs for 2.0.6 which REQUIRE the Nuttzy BBCode-thingy - which wasn't approved...?!? /me thinks someones pants were too tight or mebbe them group members are swapping underwear again ROFL

[Nuttzy99]

/me thinks someones pants were too tight

ROFL! You have no idea

I will address anything related to path of the stored files on the Styles discussion. I will answer ET's questions in a seperate post. The crux of the matter here is what language to use for template commands. The intent is that authors will be center around communities that have particular standards. I'm designing for the international sites as phpbb.com and therefore I cannot assume that everyone using EM will know English nor do I want to force it upon them.

I'm not particularly concerned about their being too big a difference with the wording of commands b/c I feel the communites will be able to maintain these standards, especially with the benefit of having things work in EM. EM will know these commands for each language b/c (after consulting with any known international sites) the wording for them will be stored in the corresponding lang_easymod.php translation.

So since I'm coding EM to be international, it really doesn't make much sense (to me) to require everyone that wants to install a translation to understand English. Also in the case when you are installing a lang that you don't know, this is a non-issue since EM will understand the commands for this language and you don't have to. There is no real need for translations of translations.

-Nuttzy