hanakin.. You said
But that is what my entire post was about. So if you agree with that then you agree with my other points. Otherwise you completely misread my meaning..
I was just building off of what you said, and agreeing... And you are correct, JQUERY is included.
Where to begin...
using a framework is not a good idea at least not for a final version of a theme. One can be used in development but the goal is to serf customized experience with the fastest page load on a per page basis which is not possible with them. I have started a lot of these things in a theme that will be released pre 4.0 as the timeline for this is probably at the 5-10 yrs off mark. https://area51.phpbb.com/phpBB/viewtopi ... 81&t=44231
I also agree with this
The labeling isn't hugely important. But developers today are too focused on these terms. All it does is create fads and steer developers away from what is important. I was just pointing out that people have skewed perceptions, they can read a five page paper and derive their own meaning based off of two words and entirely miss the point. You're going to have those people out there who hear the words "flat design" and think of one set thing and totally be against everything from the start because to them, those two words are a set identifier to one possibility.. (Like I said above, I do not feel like the type of design is as important as organizing the content. And I will always feel that is a good way to look at web design.)
No where did I say zdzichu3000 was wrong. There is a huge growing need for tablet and mobile device support, but saying that flat design being the future is wrong. Flat design isn't anything new or revolutionary.
He goes onto to say that
Everything has to be scalable
. Zooming in and out (Ctrl+ +, Ctrl + -) can not reduce the quality of the graphics. We have confidence that all devices will be high-quality graphics. So instead of the buttons like that:
This is entirely true, but it doesn't have a thing to do with flat design. It has to do with minimizing the amount of images that a design uses, using em for fonts, and percentages for widths in order to establish a 'clean' and 'responsive' design. These concepts didn't derive from flat design. These are principals that have been acknowledged for years.
What is amazing about CSS3 is that you can do all of these things that in the past you had to use an image to accomplish. Things like box shadows, gradients, rounded corners, etc. It is the innovation of new coding standards, practices, and ideas that are moving web development into the future, not some design category / type.
A major advancement are vector icons. The ability to rotate, change the color, and other properties of an image simply using CSS is an amazing concept. Another big thing is the ability to build two separate designs, one for mobile / tablets and one for desktops. I understand tablets are a big focus, but desktops still do need to be supported. Whether it is looked at as an "old hat" way to develop web sites or not.
One thing you said that I really agree with is when you said
hanakin wrote:Where to begin...
using a framework is not a good idea at least not for a final version of a theme.
I really believe in that view. Everyone is building some kind of framework today to try to make web development an easier job. Not only is this causing people to not learn how to code for themselves, but it is presenting the idea of using these huge frameworks with these large amounts of files when you may only need a piece or pieces of the framework. yes you can pick and choose what you need, but you still may need a large file just to use a certain piece.
Just like Symfony, I am indifferent towards it and it's implementation into phpBB. I understand it is a huge thing right now and everyone wants it, but i feel we should focus more on making phpBB easy to integrate websites in general not just certain frameworks.
The whole separating designers by their practices is silly. The fact that everyone has a different way to do or look at something means more innovative ideas, and more input for these open source projects.
Designing a forum for a mobile / tablet device will be a hard thing to do. We'll definitely have to do away with certain pieces of information normally found on the forum body / index in order to fit everything. And we'll have to decide which pieces of information must be on the index and which pieces are easily found on the other pages. Items like the number of posts and topics come to mind. Those are two items that can be taken from the forum-list body and give us more width on the screen for the forum title / description area, and last forum posted to area. We don't really need to know how many topics or posts there are in the index. These are things we can display once you are in a specific forum. These are things I feel should be addressed before any specific design type is set in place.
On another topic. There wasn't any need to be rude to renegade..
ok did you only do the front page or did you handle all of the sub pages as well? Also did you take into account responsive when you planned it? Just looking at this screenshot does not provide us with any of that information. Just looking at though tells me that it is not responive all you did was romve the round corners, add icons to the tabs and alter some colours and spacing a bit.
Do you see why more explanation is required here.
You claim I was being anal, but what does this sound like? ...
First off, you simply said, "responsive". What does that even mean? New developers need to clarify what responsive design is. Everyone wants to throw this word around but now explain it. You say that by lookingat it tells you that it isnt responsive, but that is impossible to tell. You have no idea if it
A. uses em for fonts
B. has one class or id that wraps the entire design with a min-wdith assigned so that the content doesn't shrink to much when the browser is shrunk (prosilver is responsive but has a min-width of 650px)
C uses percentages for its containers
How can you tell by looking at a picture that his design does not include these things? Don't say, "that was my point" either. I am refering to when you said, "Just looking at though tells me that it is not responive." You say it like it is a fact that he hasn't included these thing.. When there is no way of honestly knowing..
We are getting way off base now. I feel like the first priority of a new design it the quality of code and using updated code, then organization, then the look. As far as the admin panel is concerned this thread isn't even about that. So no reason to argue or be rude over it.