Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

General discussion of development ideas and the approaches taken in the 3.x branch of phpBB. The next feature release of phpBB 3 will be 3.3/Proteus.
Forum rules
Please do not post support questions regarding installing, updating, or upgrading phpBB 3.1. If you need support for phpBB 3.1 please visit the 3.1.x Support Forum on phpbb.com.

If you have questions regarding writing extensions please post in Extension Writers Discussion to receive proper guidance from our staff and community.
Post Reply
blockrocker
Registered User
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:38 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by blockrocker » Tue Mar 19, 2013 4:24 pm

Here are some of the features a integrated reputation system might make possible:
-Reward posters by earned reputation in order to increase forum activity (great for a starting forum and better than simply rewarding based on the number of posts since this creates spam)
-Track unwanted behavior by monitoring negative reputation users
-Get input from users that don't have the time to write, in the form of a quick vote (a upvote/downvote from an expert might be highly valuable input on a subject). In general, it will probably increase amount of total user input.
-Automatically detect spam messages by moving them into moderation queue after enough downvotes from users with high reputation
-Give the experts a way of benefiting from their effort by making it possible to show high rep points to employers (this is what's happening at Stack Overflow = good rep, easy to get jobs online)
-Make duplicate topics easy to spot because of user input (this works great at Stack Exchange)
-In general, rewarding good behavior and punishing bad behavior in s great way to motivate people to put in an effort.
-Give users the option to sort answers in the order of upvotes, which makes finding the best answers and detecting bad answers really easy (just like Stack Overflow)
-Give users the option to see which topics are highly interesting to others (if many have upvoted an unanswered thread it means that many are interested in that topic)

User avatar
Pony99CA
Registered User
Posts: 986
Joined: Sun Feb 08, 2009 2:35 am
Location: Hollister, CA
Contact:

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by Pony99CA » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:09 pm

Ger wrote: IMHO, phpBB devs should focus on 2 things:
1. The very basic functions forum software should have (needed for posting, moderation, administration, etc.)
2. A powerful plugin system

This way, the core stays light and fast, while everyone can easily make his board unique and fit to exactly their needs.
They can only "easily" do it if there's a plug-in available.

The problem is that your list of items is missing what I think is an important item:

3. Officially-supported plug-ins containing important function that doesn't necessarily fit in the core.

Given #3, the phpBB developement team (or MOD team) could create plug-ins that would be guaranteed to work and be supported in future releases of phpBB. You could even remove some features from the core and make them extensions (a "phpBB 3.0 compatibility pack"), such as Jabber support, birthdays, friends/foes, etc. As long as phpBB stands behind the extensions, I don't think people would be hesitant to use them.

So, while I don't feel that Reputation/Voting is truly a "core" bulletin board function, I also think that it would be very useful and don't believe that it's inconsistent with a board (something like user blogs or a calendar would be more inconsistent with a board, although still useful). Given that, a Reputation/Voting officially-supported extension would be perfect for this.

Steve
Silicon Valley Pocket PC (http://www.svpocketpc.com)
Creator of manage_bots and spoof_user (ask me)
Need hosting for a small forum with full cPanel & MySQL access? Contact me or PM me.

KnocksX
Registered User
Posts: 80
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 2:03 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by KnocksX » Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:26 pm

callumacrae wrote: If a mobile phone only had the capability to make calls and texts built in, and then the user could download a web browser through an app store (similar to a modification through the customisation database), there wouldn't be any problems. I, for one, get annoyed when mobile phone manufacturers force stuff I don't want like the stocks app (or reputation in phpBB) onto me, and would much prefer less built in, and more downloadable through the app store.
I really hope you're joking. Most people have no idea how to download a browser, and if browser's weren't included with phones, there would be no mobile web at all.

User avatar
DavidIQ
Customisations Team Leader
Customisations Team Leader
Posts: 1775
Joined: Thu Mar 02, 2006 4:29 pm
Location: Earth
Contact:

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by DavidIQ » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:33 am

KnocksX wrote:
callumacrae wrote: If a mobile phone only had the capability to make calls and texts built in, and then the user could download a web browser through an app store (similar to a modification through the customisation database), there wouldn't be any problems. I, for one, get annoyed when mobile phone manufacturers force stuff I don't want like the stocks app (or reputation in phpBB) onto me, and would much prefer less built in, and more downloadable through the app store.
I really hope you're joking. Most people have no idea how to download a browser, and if browser's weren't included with phones, there would be no mobile web at all.
He's from the UK, home of the "browser ballot" system. :roll: (there should be a puke smiley...)
Image

User avatar
tmbackoff
Registered User
Posts: 180
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2010 3:25 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by tmbackoff » Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:34 pm

blockrocker wrote:Here are some of the features a integrated reputation system might make possible:
-Reward posters by earned reputation in order to increase forum activity (great for a starting forum and better than simply rewarding based on the number of posts since this creates spam)
-Track unwanted behavior by monitoring negative reputation users
-Get input from users that don't have the time to write, in the form of a quick vote (a upvote/downvote from an expert might be highly valuable input on a subject). In general, it will probably increase amount of total user input.
-Automatically detect spam messages by moving them into moderation queue after enough downvotes from users with high reputation
-Give the experts a way of benefiting from their effort by making it possible to show high rep points to employers (this is what's happening at Stack Overflow = good rep, easy to get jobs online)
-Make duplicate topics easy to spot because of user input (this works great at Stack Exchange)
-In general, rewarding good behavior and punishing bad behavior in s great way to motivate people to put in an effort.
-Give users the option to sort answers in the order of upvotes, which makes finding the best answers and detecting bad answers really easy (just like Stack Overflow)
-Give users the option to see which topics are highly interesting to others (if many have upvoted an unanswered thread it means that many are interested in that topic)
Bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat (I think I covered all 8 points of yours). Personally, I think the "reputation" should be vote up or vote down. Nothing else! If people want to expand on that, then create a plugin for it. I wan to be clear - I'm not against such a system going it, but it needs to be basic (again, just vote up and vote down). Adding all these unnecessary crap just makes the stuff more complex and steers phpBB away from it's core purpose - to create discussions.

KnocksX
Registered User
Posts: 80
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2012 2:03 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by KnocksX » Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:37 pm

t_backoff wrote:Adding all these unnecessary crap just makes the stuff more complex and steers phpBB away from it's core purpose - to create discussions.
phpBB doesn't create discussions. People create discussions. And social features encourage people to make better discussions. The Internet has changed and is continuing to change at a rapid pace. If all you want to do is fix bugs and never take any risks, then this software is doomed.

blockrocker
Registered User
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:38 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by blockrocker » Fri Mar 22, 2013 7:09 pm

Bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat bloat (I think I covered all 8 points of yours).
Do you feel the same way about Youtube's thumbs up/thumbs down system? Is the Facebook's like system also unnecessary bloat? Or the rating-system at eBay? What do all those systems have in common? They create more relevant information and people love them. Funniest thing is that there is a birthday-feature in the core. I can't imagine anything more unnecessary than that.
Personally, I think the "reputation" should be vote up or vote down. Nothing else!
I take whatever you're giving as a start. Just please give us something.
If people want to expand on that, then create a plugin for it. I wan to be clear - I'm not against such a system going it, but it needs to be basic (again, just vote up and vote down).
I'm sorry to say this but PhpBB has the worst plugin system of any CMS I have used. I think people would be more happy to use plugins if they could actually trust a.)That the plugins work also with future releases b.)That the plugins work also with other themes than the basic ProSilver one. c.)That the plugin installation is a one click thing like in other systems.
Adding all these unnecessary crap just makes the stuff more complex and steers phpBB away from it's core purpose - to create discussions.
If the quality of those discussions is poor compared to more advanced systems, then why would people choose to read those discussions from a phpBB board? We as board admins rely on people creating good relevant content for _free_. Anything that makes that task feel more addictive and fun should be a core part of the software.

User avatar
keith10456
Registered User
Posts: 523
Joined: Sat Apr 22, 2006 10:29 pm
Contact:

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by keith10456 » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:23 pm

blockrocker wrote:
If people want to expand on that, then create a plugin for it. I wan to be clear - I'm not against such a system going it, but it needs to be basic (again, just vote up and vote down).
I'm sorry to say this but PhpBB has the worst plugin system of any CMS I have used. I think people would be more happy to use plugins if they could actually trust a.)That the plugins work also with future releases b.)That the plugins work also with other themes than the basic ProSilver one. c.)That the plugin installation is a one click thing like in other systems.
This has been addressed with phpBB v3.1.

Oleg
Posts: 1150
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:38 am
Contact:

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by Oleg » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:27 pm

Stack exchange software had been specifically developed for Q&A format. phpbb is not going to be better for that task no matter what we do.

That said, proposals for augmenting phpbb with functionality that has real use cases among users of phpbb is pretty much the definition of RFCs. The key in that phrase is "real use cases among users of phpbb".

blockrocker
Registered User
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun Mar 17, 2013 10:38 am

Re: Biggest competition threats to PHPBB forums

Post by blockrocker » Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:42 pm

Stack exchange software had been specifically developed for Q&A format. phpbb is not going to be better for that task no matter what we do.
While it might not get better, it can still get "good enough". And it doesn't even need a very complicated system: shouldn't a database table for users and another for posts be enough to store upvote/downvote information and then these tables would be used when the user wants to organize posts/topics/users by the amount of votes received? I don't see how two tables could be called "bloat".

In the bigger picture we are talking about information here. PhpBB is a system that is used to organize and distribute information. Now a competitor has arrived with means of creating better, more relevant information. This is why PhpBB needs to develop tools in order to offer more relevant information to it's users. Can you argue that in the world of information overflow and 1 billion websites the winners are not the ones with the best information to offer? Google proved that point perfectly with it's core products: search and adwords. Both systems pretty much killed the competition by giving the users more relevant and higher quality information than others with similar products.

Post Reply