New feature - auto follow up of posts

[Oleg]

Wouldn't this be the same as getting a daily/weekly digest of updates for each topic, much like vBulletin does?

For my use case something like a search type for "highlighted" topics would work. In my case topics without updates should still be included in the display.

It's kind of like bookmarks but with two differences:

1. Put the search link next to active topic/egosearch, not bury it in ucp.

2. The topics lose relevance after, say, 2 weeks if I have not read them. Bookmarks in my understanding are for more permanently relevant topics.

[Oleg]

I wonder if your actual scenario could be satisfied in most cases with a feature phpBB already has: View unanswered posts.

The problem with that, basically, is that answered is not the same as solved.

[tellmethis]

I wonder if your actual scenario could be satisfied in most cases with a feature phpBB already has: View unanswered posts.

A good thought, however in the event that I want to be reminded to revisit a single post, I don't want to have to spend time locating that post amongst many others. Also, it doesn't solve my need for a 'pushed' reminder.

I understand your point about the downside of email reminders, and I agree email is not perfect, but in the absence of easier and more effective implementations, it's better than not being able to easily remind myself at all.

An alternative to email reminders could be something similar to View unanswered posts, eg. View posts for which I have set a follow up date. Something similar to a topic icon could, say, glow red if new items have appeared since the user last visited that particular queue. For each item in the queue, the user could be given the option to change the follow up date to a future date. This would have the effect of removing the post from the follow up queue, only to reappear once the new date had arrived.

[DavidIQ]

Wouldn't this be the same as getting a daily/weekly digest of updates for each topic, much like vBulletin does?

For my use case something like a search type for "highlighted" topics would work. In my case topics without updates should still be included in the display.

It's kind of like bookmarks but with two differences:

1. Put the search link next to active topic/egosearch, not bury it in ucp.

2. The topics lose relevance after, say, 2 weeks if I have not read them. Bookmarks in my understanding are for more permanently relevant topics.

I think at this point we're going to need some sort of drop-down to take care of all of the different searches, which might not be a bad idea as the amount of links available for searches (egosearch, etc.) is getting a bit cluttered.

[Pony99CA]

However, I fail to see why the OP can't just open a Task in Outlook (or some other To-Do List manager) and paste a link to the topic or post in that. Why does this function need to exist in phpBB at all?

It's about efficiency - number of clicks and overall time taken. Whether I set a date and/or time within phpBB or a 3rd party reminder manager, the actual date/time nomination will take about the same effort. But if a 3rd party reminder manager is used, I also have to (i) potentially launch the 3rd party application in order to set up the reminder and (ii) manually create a nexus between the phpBB post and the 3rd party application - this could be as simple as copy & pasting the post's URL, but it's an extra step nonetheless.

There's efficiency, and then there's efficiency. I find it more efficient to set and track my various To-Do items in one location -- Outlook in my case. Having to use Outlook for some, set others in one board and check E-mail for the reminder, set still others on another board and check E-mail for those, etc. just becomes a mess.

I suppose if you don't keep a To-Do list and you're only going to set reminders on one board, your way might be slightly more efficient, but a few extra steps isn't a killer. In fact, Steve Krug, author of "Don't Make Me Think', says that (for Web sites), it's not so much about minimizing the number of clicks as it is making each step require as little thought as possible. If you're accustomed to using a To-Do program, that's more ingrained than having to use another feature in a board.

Also remember that phpBB doesn't seem to have true push capabilities. Your reminders might only be triggered by cron.php, which only runs when a user does certain things. If there isn't any user activiity around the time that your reminder is supposed to be sent, you won't get it until a user does something.

Steve

[tellmethis]

Understand what you're saying Steve. No doubt it boils down to personal preferences. If the feature existed in phpBB though, then users have choice, and choice represents value.

In the absence of an easy 'push' implementation, for me personally, that in itself wouldn't matter so much. The most important benefit for me with such a feature would be a quick and easy method of "don't let me forget about that". Even if I could access a list of nominated forget-me-nots next time I logged in to the forum. This would obviate the necessity, as phpBB currently stands, to engage a different application altogether for arguably a very simple step. Right now, if I want a particular topic not to slip through the cracks, I either rely on a 3rd party to respond to my post, which effectively acts as a reminder via reply notification (and you know how reliable 3rd parties can be), or crank up a separate application capable of issuing me a future reminder.

[Pony99CA]

In the absence of an easy 'push' implementation, for me personally, that in itself wouldn't matter so much.

Just in case my previous point wasn't clear, let's assume that you just started a board and only one user has registered and posted a question. You've subscribed to the forum and so got a notification of the new topic. You read the topic, but don't have time to answer it, so you post that you'll answer within two days and you set a reminder. Now both you and the user are busy, so neither of you checks the board for three days. If nobody else visited your board to trigger cron.php, no reminder will have been sent before two days were up. That seems to fail your requirement.

The most important benefit for me with such a feature would be a quick and easy method of "don't let me forget about that". Even if I could access a list of nominated forget-me-nots next time I logged in to the forum.

But what happens, as in the case above, where you don't visit your board for three days because you're busy doing something else?

This would obviate the necessity, as phpBB currently stands, to engage a different application altogether for arguably a very simple step.

But you have engaged a different application if you want a notification sent to you -- your E-mail client or IM client. So using a To-Do list is just replacing one application with another. (I realize that it's not quite the same. You use your E-mail or IM client to check subscription notices, so you could say that my solution requires two extra programs, but they're two different use cases, too.)

Right now, if I want a particular topic not to slip through the cracks, I either rely on a 3rd party to respond to my post, which effectively acts as a reminder via reply notification (and you know how reliable 3rd parties can be), or crank up a separate application capable of issuing me a future reminder.

You could probably try PMing yourself. If you posted an "I'll get back to you" post, click the PM link there and it will include a link back to your post. Title the PM "Don't forget to respond to..." and send it. The next time that you visit, if you have PM pop-ups on, you might get that pop-up.

I say "might" because I haven't tested how the "New Message" pop-up works. Will it pop-up every time until you read the PM, or just the first time that you do anything in phpBB?

UPDATE: It may only pop up once, and that time might we when you send the PM to yourself (if you aren't taken to your Inbox directly). However, if you close the browser tab/window containing the Sent Successfully message, you'll still see New Message alert on your board (at least until you visit your Inbox). To fix that, you could probably create a MOD (if it doesn't already exist) that pops the window open on unread (instead of new) PMs and change the message to flag unread PMs. That would probably be simpler than trying to create a reminder feature. Of course, it still has the downside that it requires you to visit your board before the time limit expired.

By the way, this isn't an attack on the idea. I'm just trying to point out the problems with the proposal and suggest other alternatives that are available using the current phpBB release. I do think that the feature has limited uses, though, and would probably serve a niche smaller than most items that should be considered for core phpBB features. I don't recall seeing a similar request, but have seen many other features requested numerous times.

Steve

[tellmethis]

Yep, acknowledge there are plenty of workarounds. After all, I have workarounds in place now because the feature doesn't exist. But each time I engage one of those workarounds, I'm thinking "how much easier it would be if only ...".

I've not used PMs myself, but based on how you describe them, PMs might work if you'd like to be reminded next time you login. However I don't necessarily want to be reminded next time I log in, that could be too soon ... I want to be reminded at a pre-determined date, or in 7 days, or in a month, whatever the case may be, or if necessary only after that nominated date/time passes. But ... if a PM could be created now, but marked to send not before a nominated future date/time, then that should effectively serve as a reminder system. Perhaps this could be considered - enhancing the existing PM feature such that a user could easily send him or herself a PM (or any user for that matter), for appearance only after a future date/time passes.

[Pony99CA]

Yep, acknowledge there are plenty of workarounds. After all, I have workarounds in place now because the feature doesn't exist. But each time I engage one of those workarounds, I'm thinking "how much easier it would be if only ...".

But none of the methods proposed would be as reliable as a proper To-Do list (as long as you've integrated launching the To-Do list into your daily habits, as I have).

I've not used PMs myself, but based on how you describe them, PMs might work if you'd like to be reminded next time you login. However I don't necessarily want to be reminded next time I log in, that could be too soon ... I want to be reminded at a pre-determined date, or in 7 days, or in a month, whatever the case may be, or if necessary only after that nominated date/time passes.

Just because you set a date to respond to the customer doesn't mean that you couldn't do it earler. If you changed the "New PMs" to "Unread PMs", you'd see unread PMs every time you looked at the top of the board. When you checked to see what they were about (to see if any were from other users), you'd be reminded of your task. If you had time, you could do it then; otherwise you wouldn't read the PM and it would still be there nagging you until you got it done.

Another use for reminders might be for things like contest topics, where you had to enter by a certain time. You could set a reminder to lock the topic after that time. However, a better way to do that would be using events (which don't yet exist in phpBB ), where you'd create a time-based event to lock the topic automatically after that time. That's even better than a reminder because no manual intervention is required to lock the topic. (You might want to set a reminder to remind you to announce the winner, though.)

If an event system is created in phpBB, and if it supported a generic pop-up/E-mail/message facility, you could use that to send reminders. I don't know if the event facility would be available to all users or just admins (and possibly moderators), but that would still work for you even if only available to admins.

The more I think about events, the better they sound.

Steve

[tellmethis]

If it was up to me alone, I'd incorporate to-do functionality, calendar functionality, reminder functionality .. all of them .. into phpBB. It's a fairly evenly divided argument - according to Wikipedia's comparison chart, about 42% of PHP-based forum software has inbuilt calendar functionality. But I recognise the arguments against, and downsides of, software going too far beyond its core purpose. That's why I'd be content with a very simple date/time based reminder solution (without having to resort to MODs).

But none of the methods proposed would be as reliable as a proper To-Do list (as long as you've integrated launching the To-Do list into your daily habits, as I have).

I'm not sure I'd be brave enough to define what constitutes a proper To-Do list - that could be as simple as sticking a note to the fridge if it works for you. These things are more about how you manage them rather than the form they take. Regardless of how easy it is to add something to a To-Do list, sometimes it's just not worth the bother. Not important enough, but at the same time you prefer not to forget about it altogether. I simply want to be able to remind myself later with a couple of quick clicks. I'm not talking about relying on phpBB to be my full blown life management system.

Just because you set a date to respond to the customer doesn't mean that you couldn't do it earler. If you changed the "New PMs" to "Unread PMs", you'd see unread PMs every time you looked at the top of the board. When you checked to see what they were about (to see if any were from other users), you'd be reminded of your task. If you had time, you could do it then; otherwise you wouldn't read the PM and it would still be there nagging you until you got it done.

I guess it boils down to personal preferences, and choice. Personally, I don't want something constantly in my face if I don't need to think about it until some future time. I want to be able to put something out of sight, out of mind, until the next earliest time it can be revisited. If that point is reached, but I don't have time for it, then I postpone it by repeating the process. If suddenly I have time on my hands and I want to take care of some things that I may have previously scheduled for the future, then it'd be nice to think you could take a peek at all of those pending reminders.

I'm also not talking about using phpBB for all reminders in my life. Simply those reminders which relate to a phpBB post. Whilst I'm there. Click-click. Done. But not forgotten.