Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

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Discuss features as they are added to the new version. Give us your feedback. Don't post bug reports, feature requests, support questions or suggestions here. Feature requests are closed.
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Mvastango
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by Mvastango »

geocator wrote:And then there are individual states that have there own thing too. This is why many feel that auto DST just wont work. You would have to have a list a mile long of locations for each user to select from.
See the time zone selection within windows. It is extremely simple. Granted there are quite a few choices, but the list is short enough to be user-friendly.
geocator wrote:Add into this what the originall poster wants wich is to show the time based on wherther it was posted during dst and you have a mess on you hands. Each post would haveto have the users setting atthed to it etc.
I'm not understanding. Why would that be needed? Even if one more boolean check was required, the additional processing time would probably be negligable. Regardless. It's a mod. Just about any mod that adds functionality is going to require more resources. It is the forum administrator's job to preform a cost-benefit analysis to determine whether the mod is right for their forum. If after seeing the fraction of a second that this change would add to the forum load time, you feel that it's not worth it, so be it.
geocator
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by geocator »

Mvastango wrote:Just about any mod that adds functionality is going to require more resources. It is the forum administrator's job to preform a cost-benefit analysis to determine whether the mod is right for their forum. If after seeing the fraction of a second that this change would add to the forum load time, you feel that it's not worth it, so be it.
And thats just it, I think that as a MOD it is a good idea. I just dont think it needs to be implemented in core code.
Mvastango
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by Mvastango »

Ok. I guess that's where we disagree. To me, the negligiable time increase it totally worth the times being displayed the way they should be. That isn't even taking into consideration the time already spent on the current 2.2 to render the times, making the increase even more negligable. Unfortunately, however, the dev team has made it clear that they have no plans to include this functionality into their core code. To me, this is a terrible idea for a mod, because it ads a tiny bit of functionality that would rarely be noticed. On the rare occasion that it is noticed, the problems created by the way the times are now are so minimal that they really don't justify the initiative required to install the mod.
The way I see it, if it was included in the main distribution, for users who live in areas with DST, the wost case is that the users don't have to change their DST settings semi-anually. The best case is that they actually need the times to be accurate, and phpBB delivers that. The only tradeoff is the additional page generation time. The 0.002502 seconds maximum that this feature adds to the page load time on my CPU seems well worth it.
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CodeBuster
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by CodeBuster »

What I don't get is... why it actually IS a feature. Because it makes no difference with changing timezone like I do in 2.0 It just add's an hour to everything.

that is just plain wrong. Do it right or don't do it at all. Ofcourse, this is still CVS so maybe.. keeps fingers crossed..
richardwhiuk
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by richardwhiuk »

Who cares whether a post they made a while ago has the correct time or not? To be honest with you, I doubt that people most of the time don't look at the times on posts, and when they do it will be the previous post in the thread.

So this is a feature request. You want the database to store the time is when it was posted. This is not (easily) possible. Unix timestamps are just about the only way to accuratly store date and time. Many different dbs do things differently. For example

In access a date needs to be stored inside hashes. So it becomes #12/4/03# while mySQL doesn't.

Someone lock this thread.
Mvastango
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by Mvastango »

richardwhiuk wrote:Who cares whether a post they made a while ago has the correct time or not? To be honest with you, I doubt that people most of the time don't look at the times on posts, and when they do it will be the previous post in the thread.
Well, for one, the person who started this thread cares. Call me anal, or a perfectionist, but just because people probably won't notice is not a reason not to make something as correct as can be within reason.
richardwhiuk wrote:So this is a feature request. You want the database to store the time is when it was posted. This is not (easily) possible. Unix timestamps are just about the only way to accuratly store date and time. Many different dbs do things differently. For example

In access a date needs to be stored inside hashes. So it becomes #12/4/03# while mySQL doesn't.
I'm not sure if you didn't read the whole thread, or you just aren't that knowledgable about SQL/php, but the idea was never to chnage the way the times were stored. Times now are stored with a universal timezone. What is at issue is utilizing is taking the post's timestamp and from that calculating the GMT offset that should be used with it, based on the time of year it was posted and the reader's location.
richardwhiuk wrote:Someone lock this thread.
Personally, I don't look at this as a feature request, but instead, a discussion about whether a certain fuctionality belongs in phpBB. Call it splitting hairs or whatever, but I don't think anyone posting here actually intended to break the forum rules. If the devs feel we did, they should feel free to lock this thread.

I must say though, that I do find it just a wee bit hypocritical that in one breath you tell me how I'm wrong for breaking a forum rule, and then in another, you yourself break a forum rule in demanding that the mods lock this.
SamG
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by SamG »

CodeBuster wrote:What I don't get is... why it actually IS a feature. Because it makes no difference with changing timezone like I do in 2.0 It just add's an hour to everything.

that is just plain wrong. Do it right or don't do it at all. Ofcourse, this is still CVS so maybe.. keeps fingers crossed..
I'm for not doing it at all, then. I'm happy to make the adjustment manually twice a year, knowing that that the post time is close enough for most practical purposes, as over against phpBB having to know if and how DST is handled all over the world and having to do the calcs on every post date in real time for every logged in page view.

The thread starter would have been happy with automatically adjusted dates for a single time zone, leaving things as is otherwise, by the way ...
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CodeBuster
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by CodeBuster »

richardwhiuk wrote:Who cares whether a post they made a while ago has the correct time or not?
yeah right... what world you live in??
try to sell that to somebody who is using it for customer support

anyways.. I go for adding it myself
place witty phrase here
Mvastango
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by Mvastango »

SamG wrote: I'm for not doing it at all, then. I'm happy to make the adjustment manually twice a year, knowing that that the post time is close enough for most practical purposes, as over against phpBB having to know if and how DST is handled all over the world and having to do the calcs on every post date in real time for every logged in page view.

The thread starter would have been happy with automatically adjusted dates for a single time zone, leaving things as is otherwise, by the way ...
Yes, all the thread starter wanted was posts to store the time they were posted under the board's locat timezone. As the devs said (and I agree), this was an 'obtuse' solution. It isn't scalable across countries and time zones, and therefore would definitiely not be implimented into the core code. My solution to this problem, however, addresses all people in all possible locations, while still preserving the accuracy of the post times and at the expense of only an extremely small increase in page generation time. Yes, you are right. The 1 hour difference is fine for most applications, but there is no reason not to make the board work for all applications, were easily feasible.
geocator
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Re: Daylight Saving Time (DST) within one country

Post by geocator »

Sure there is, the whole phpBB philosphy is KISS, if a feature has limited purpose then it stays as a MOD. As far as processing time goes think about those boards with hundreds of people on at time, with millions of posts.
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