still no real plugin system for phpBB?

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Discussion of general topics related to the new release and its place in the world. Don't discuss new features, report bugs, ask for support, et cetera. Don't use this to spam for other boards or attack those boards!
maddes
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still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by maddes »

Hello,
this is the first time i' looking closer to whats going on with the upcoming phpBB3. So, it seems a major step to me (I apreciate this), and old mods will not work anymore.
But as far as it seems to me, there is still no real plugin-system for phpBB?
New MODs will still be MODs, meaning: They actually CHANGE code of the original phpBB?
I think you surpassed a big chance in stabilizing phpBB, or is there anything I missed?
hakre
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by hakre »

We'll I'm currently taking a look on the new phpbb3 and love the UCP/MCP/ACP thingy a lot. But that love ends quite fast because of: Languages that need to be hacked into common.php for the module-names and module-actions names-sake only! That really sucks. I mean it really sucks. So why does it really suck? Well: You still need to touch files of the core distributions of phpBB only to add functionality. Even if it's a theme or language only (for a simple mod that might be possible but is quite theoretical afterall) it really sucks. I mean it really sucks. Why does it really suck even if you only need to hack a language and theme file only? Because these files change and you can not generally hack them all the same way because they never are the same. So this must lead to errors, errors that might even get critical for a users installation.

So even If I know that this really sucks and why it really sucks and realising that phpbb3 devs have not had the time to really think about a modding or better said a plugin system here are the resources so far I think that are usefull for getting the most of a non existing API for phpbb3 add-on developers:

* http://www.phpbb.com/mods/documentation/
* http://area51.phpbb.com/docs/code/

I would really love to see some features inside phpbb3 that make Modding easier and less error prone:

Auto-loading language files
common.php is loaded all the time. why not having a registering function that points to one or more other language files that are loaded right away and out of the box. that would prevent a mod to modify common.php in the languages folder.

Plugin Class
/mod and autoload plugin classes in there. That would help a lot. No more copy there open that file there and change that line after that text blaaaaaaah. I mean who really wants go through files and edit this or that and end up in a messed installation. And I know what I do. There are so many kids out there (watch the phpbb2 userbase) who just start to use PHP. The one thing is to activate them to start learning and found usergroups but the other is to realize that the phpbb userbase needs some support and some lead in the right direction. So let's have an easier way for plugins. Everybody loves it. So why not implementing that? Why not making it right this time? What are the options. I Bet I am not the only one saying that. I Bet this discussion is already running and I bet there are more Devs who like to spend some brain, time and code on that Issue.

Hooks and Plugin Classese
You can register a class that can contain one or multiple hooks that might be called when applicable. That can be registering BB-Code extensions or getting the Profile Data / Profile Template. I don't know wehter or not the Devs Team ever thought about something like that. From a Developers Perspective the way you can find it in wordpress is quite nice but no that stable sothat I would suggest a class based mechanism.

PHP 5.2 and higher
What about the phpBB Team joining the gophp5 movement? http://gophp5.org/ - I mean this is version 3 and all new, why do you guys don't make it 5.2 and higher ready. I would love to see that. This would clear things out for Admins and Users as well and I bet this would even make phpbb3 core and mods development easier.
Image

Phew, that's a lot I know. And my english is not the best so please do not feel offended only. I know that you all put a hard work into phpbb3 and I can see a lot of improvement of the overall product that I really like. But I am shure that if Modding becomes more structured that will kick-ass the project. My 2 cents.

--hakre
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Kellanved
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by Kellanved »

hakre wrote:We'll I'm currently taking a look on the new phpbb3 and love the UCP/MCP/ACP thingy a lot. But that love ends quite fast because of: Languages that need to be hacked into common.php for the module-names and module-actions names-sake only! That really sucks. I mean it really sucks.
That's no longer the case in the current dev version
PHP 5.2 and higher
What about the phpBB Team joining the gophp5 movement? http://gophp5.org/ - I mean this is version 3 and all new, why do you guys don't make it 5.2 and higher ready. I would love to see that. This would clear things out for Admins and Users as well and I bet this would even make phpbb3 core and mods development easier.
Image
no. We aim for maximum compatibility; php5 is not an option for most users and isn't yet as mature as 4.x. Yes, we know about the EoL.
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hakre
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by hakre »

Kellanved wrote:That's no longer the case in the current dev version
Nice to hear. I'll do a checkout soon.
Kellanved wrote:no. We aim for maximum compatibility; php5 is not an option for most users and isn't yet as mature as 4.x. Yes, we know about the EoL.
Well nice to hear you actually know that your aims of compatibilty are out of date quite soon. It's really great you put that much affords in a thing that is not yet outdated. Can you tell me about the compatibility rate to PHP 5.2 and above? You ensure 100% here? Can you give a quick overview for that matter (PHP 5.2 & 6)?
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Nicholas the Italian
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by Nicholas the Italian »

hakre wrote:... That really sucks. I mean it really sucks. So why does it really suck? ... it really sucks. I mean it really sucks. Why does it really suck ... So even If I know that this really sucks and why it really sucks ...
You do not encourage people to read your post, you know?
Can you tell me about the compatibility rate to PHP 5.2 and above? You ensure 100% here? Can you give a quick overview for that matter (PHP 5.2 & 6)?
As far as I know, phpBB3 should be 100% PHP 5.x compatible and also rather PHP 6-draft compatible. Are you aware of any particoular issue?
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Kellanved
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by Kellanved »

As far as I know, phpBB3 should be 100% PHP 5.x compatible and also rather PHP 6-draft compatible.
Correct. We support 4.3 because we can. 5.x functions are used where available. Maximum compatibility.
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hakre
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by hakre »

Nicholas the Italian wrote:You do not encourage people to read your post, you know?
I just wanted to make it bold and that was by choosing repetiton as the way of doing so. As written my english is not that well, you know? Sorry if that offended you I love sucking a lot. It was meant like it keeps taking of you.
Cole2026
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by Cole2026 »

I think the one thing PHPBB really needs is a plugins/hooks/products system, possibly similar to how vBulletin does it?. It is extremely aggravating to modify the code so extensively when I want to add some new functionality. Upgrading would be no problem then, and keeping track of modifications would be so much easier! I would have no doubt the entire community would be grateful to see this. Coders would be happy to release modifications through the easy system, and normal forum owners would be able to install different modifications with a simple upload.
SamG
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by SamG »

I don't think anybody disagrees that a plug-in system would be really nice. But we have to put a couple of things into perspective, I think, to appreciate where phpBB is at.

The first is the huge progress made in making MODing easier from phpBB 1.x. Anybody who ran a phpBB 1.x forum can truly enjoy the improvements phpBB has undergone in terms of MODing. Updates were a relative nightmare, and there was no such thing as EasyMOD.

The second thing is that phpBB 3 isn't as new as it seems. That's another story, and it's not an entirely happy one, but phpBB 3.0 was at first phpBB 2.2, and the road to release has been a long one. That uphill climb was the inspiration for the product codename “Olympus” (as in the enormous Martian mountain), and as we all know, we still haven't quite reached the top. :)

I think we can anticipate further improvements in phpBB's MODing process, just as we've been able to enjoy them to date.
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hakre
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Re: still no real plugin system for phpBB?

Post by hakre »

Thanks for the insight. And I'm happy to hear all that. It might be a way of Modding such a Hook / Plugin System into the current release with a well made MODXed or easyMODed MOD. But that's another Story. And phpbb3 is a complex software a developer needs a quite deep insight before he/she is able do code such a thing.

I'll stay with some more MODs the classic way and hope you're making progress on the more relevant points. A good working core is even more important then having a plugin system. Anyway I really enjoy the UCP/MCP/ACP thingy as well as the ACLs and the Database abstraction. The overall speed seems to be very improved as well. This is very useable for many MODs afterall. And the Templates, gosh, far better!

For the Hooks or a Plugin-Foobar I think it's quite a long process to figure out where to place it/them. When you take a look at Wordpress for example you can see that Hooks pop up verywhere and then they disappear... That's not always the best procedure. And I suggest to have the Hooks Class and Implements based. That means PHP 5.2 and above afterall. That would make it far more serious.
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