question

Discussion of general topics related to the new version and its place in the world. Don't discuss new features, report bugs, ask for support, et cetera. Don't use this to spam for other boards or attack those boards!
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Discussion of general topics related to the new release and its place in the world. Don't discuss new features, report bugs, ask for support, et cetera. Don't use this to spam for other boards or attack those boards!
Mythotical
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question

Post by Mythotical »

Ok I have noticed that phpBB 2.1/3.0 has been worked on for the past couple of years. vBulletin just released their latest Beta, 3.5. My question: why is it taking so long to release a new version like 2.1. I'm just saying that phpBB is behind the competition so hopefully them taking so long to work on this is well worth it because I have installed the development board and I can tell you there is no real difference between it and the regular 2.0.15. No this is not a complaint, just general opinions and questions.

So my final thoughts are this, wouldn't it be easier to just get rid of all the 2.0.x and start releasing 2.1.x that way when this development is done they can just call 3.0?

If you agree with me, please state that, if you disagree with me, please state that as well.

Thanks for listening
Myth

Alagba
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Re: question

Post by Alagba »

IMHO it's questions like this that 'discourage' devs - that's my guess. The earlier people/users/fans ... realise this the sooner Olympus'll be released.

Mythotical
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Re: question

Post by Mythotical »

Discourage? Ok fair enough, but imagine if you will, you have been working on your own development project for 4 years now, and have only released 'small portions' of it to the public, don't you think after 4 years of teasing and torture they would get tired of the bitty stuff and want bigger? Thats basically what I'm saying, I know I can't be the only one because I have seen many people go to vbulletin because of how long this project has taken. I am in no way discouraging the devs, they have done great thus far, but don't they think its time to start giving support for this product after 4 years of work?

Myth

Alagba
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Re: question

Post by Alagba »

Sorry Mythotical but it's been said over and over again: it's a free world. if you like sth else, nobody's stopping you from using it. pure and simple, isn't it?

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VxJasonxV
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Re: question

Post by VxJasonxV »

Hahaha, that's funny.
"Hey guys, someone else is releasing the newest version of similar software, let's release our incomplete software to compete!"

The support forum would SCREAM if something like that happened.
"If You Support It, They Will Come."
"Construction"

ChALkeR
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Re: question

Post by ChALkeR »

Mythotical wrote: I have installed the development board and I can tell you there is no real difference between it and the regular 2.0.15
You get CVS from the RIGHT SIDE list, not the LEFT SIDE.
Image
Sorry for my bad English....

nezermundy
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Re: question

Post by nezermundy »

Also it will be called 3.0, 2.1 is the develpment name.

blobber
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Re: question

Post by blobber »

Mythotical wrote: [...]
I have installed the development board and I can tell you there is no real difference between it and the regular 2.0.15.[...]
I strongly disagree with the above statement and think that you truly must have missed a lot of details, even without looking at the code it should be pretty obvious that Olympus has become quite a monster meanwhile, at least referring to the feature set - while the latest phpBB version can considered to be "feature-lightweight", the upcoming version (from CVS) really has lots of new whistles and bells (aka features), I'd even go as far as claiming that some hardcore phpBB users are going to describe Olympus as "bloated".

On the other hand, if you are coming from the world of phpBB's commerical "competitors" you are definitely used to many things being handled differently - and in part probably also more efficiently and politely, so it's quite understandable, that the phpBB project and its policies & rules may seem lacking or even inferior to commerical forum software, also you may understandably be disappointed by phpBB if you're used to feature-rich, idiot-proof and highly extendable forum solutions, that don't require any knowledge of actual server environments or basics such as HTML, CSS, PHP, mySQL etc. - phpBB simply isn't yet there, and probably isn't going to be there anytime soon.

Concerning your question about reasons: you should be able to find numerous postings that state various reasons for phpBB's development delays, but even without consulting the search function for further answers now, you should always take into account that the project's code base isn't actually written by any siginifant "dev team" but rather only by 1.5-2.5 people at a time ...who do this in their spare time, so it should become pretty obvious that there are many potential shortcomings with that size of a dev "team", particularly when it comes to lack of spare of those people involved, so I'd recommend to bear with them - the fact, that the "phpBB Group's" team of developers is actually very small, seems to be hardly known - and I'd even bet that if a corresponding poll was started at phpBB.com, the majority of voters would assume that the dev team would at least consist of 5-8 people, rather than -at times- hardly more than 1 person in total.

So, the size of the phpBB project and its community don't seem to be currently resembled by the manpower (in actual coding hours) behind the project, which is actually kind of a vicious circle: due to the popularity of phpBB, hundreds of people each week wonder about an upcoming version and when it will be available, some of whom will start threads here or at phpBB.com providing insights into their impressions, some even offering their help/support (bug tracking/fixing, or even implementation of currently missing features) - many having problems to understand why such offers keep getting rejected, if offered by people who know what they're doing.

So, there's definitely some level of frustration within the phpBB community present, but apparently not so much because of the various release delays, but mainly because of the lack of insight into the actual development process and lack of responsiveness towards constructive suggestions or even offers.

This very frustration can frequenly be observed here and at phpBB.com - but it's certainly not helpful to even make things more difficult by repeatedly starting pointless debates - which would ultimately lead to the recently very obvious source of frustration: regular thread deletions/lockings - even of threads that discuss issues that many users would obviously like to address - and these seem to take place each month increasingly.

SamG
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Re: question

Post by SamG »

blobber wrote: ... some of whom will start threads here or at phpBB.com providing insights into their impressions, some even offering their help/support (bug tracking/fixing, or even implementation of currently missing features) - many having problems to understand why such offers keep getting rejected, if offered by people who know what they're doing.

So, there's definitely some level of frustration within the phpBB community present, but apparently not so much because of the various release delays, but mainly because of the lack of insight into the actual development process and lack of responsiveness towards constructive suggestions or even offers...
This kind of stuff seriously and consistently and repetitiously misrepresents the reality, in my opinion. What do you expect 1.5 developers to do about supposed "bug fixes" and "feature completions" to unfinished code (supplied by a variety of sources working willy nilly -- and perhaps inadvertantly even at cross purposes -- in their spare time) in their spare spare time (the part of their spare time they have left after the spare time they devote to their own coding of phpBB)? How much time do 1.5 developers have to take on new team members and bring them up to speed on where we've been, where we are, and where we're going, on what works and what doesn't (from past experience), on what is consistent with the goals for v3.0 and what isn't (Think these are non-issues? Then look at even just a fork of phpBB and see that it takes time for all the new developers to get on the same page.)? How many people actually have been added to or were members of the development team in the past, in good faith, that are now contributing nothing and have contributed nothing for a very long time (the answer is more than double the remaining 1.5)?

I could go on, but there is no benefit in it, so I'll spare everybody the rest of my rant. :)

P.S. Sorry for all the edits.
Last edited by SamG on Sat Jun 11, 2005 3:19 pm, edited 4 times in total.

q3utom
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Re: question

Post by q3utom »

You say competition. phpbb surely isn't competing with anyone as it is free software?

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