[RFC|Rejected] Include STK by default

These RFCs were either rejected or have been replaced by an alternative proposal. They will not be included in phpBB.
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jsebean
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[RFC|Rejected] Include STK by default

Post by jsebean » Tue Apr 26, 2011 9:12 pm

STK includes a database cleaner, and a number of "emergency admin tools" that are useful when needed. It's not something that would be used every day but would be convenient if it was included with phpBB. Maybe not STK itself, but something similar. Now a couple rules for it though, Mods can't touch it, it wouldn't be a "valid mod" if it effects STK, and there will be no hooks in STK since its for emergency use. Just a though. Have at it with the comments :D
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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by DavidIQ » Tue Apr 26, 2011 11:09 pm

I don't like this idea at all. If there are problems with the stk then it would not be updatable through the typical venues as they presently are. Plus the stk needs quite a bit of rework as I understand it which makes it a bit more of a problem. Not to mention that the stk is not something most admins need or would use on a regular basis. Yes I know that there are some tools that are not used often already in base but they are not as big as the stk.
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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by Marshalrusty » Wed Apr 27, 2011 3:59 am

DavidIQ wrote:I don't like this idea at all. If there are problems with the stk then it would not be updatable through the typical venues as they presently are. Plus the stk needs quite a bit of rework as I understand it which makes it a bit more of a problem. Not to mention that the stk is not something most admins need or would use on a regular basis. Yes I know that there are some tools that are not used often already in base but they are not as big as the stk.
I agree.

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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by Erik Frèrejean » Wed Apr 27, 2011 8:49 am

No, please.

This will cause more problems than that it solves, the current state of the STK where it only relies on the phpBB files makes it already vulnerable for being broken by MODs (edits in common.php/faulty hooks/etc). Including it in the core will at best keep the current state, but more likely increment the number of issues with this. Especially when hooks become the way to go in 3.2.x you can easily nuke the STK without even knowing (I've done some test cases with the current version and you can make things go really bad without to much hassle with only a hook).

Therefore we're currently rebuilding the STK from scratch and one of the major changes will be that it will ship its own set of phpBB files, so we can be sure that if the STK calls a function that, that function actually does what it is supposed to do, and that it can be ran truly stand alone from the core system.. At the moment thats always a guess as MODs can be in the way. Including the STK into phpBB at that point will mean that phpBB ships multiple sets of its own files which isn't really the way to go.

Obviously there are some tools in the STK that can possibly be ported over to phpBB itself but as these have a very limited use they just as well can remain in a separate package. I do think that phpBB and the STK can get tight bands at some time but I don't think that including the toolkit into phpBB itself is the way to go.

jsbean wrote:STK includes a database cleaner, and a number of "emergency admin tools" that are useful when needed. It's not something that would be used every day but would be convenient if it was included with phpBB.
They are marked "emergency" for a reason ;). I agree that these tools are quite useful but they should be used with caution (if something goes wrong there is almost no way to tell), therefore they should only be used when needed. If you include things like the database cleaner in the core users will run it just to see what happens. The result will be support topics like:
HELP!!!!! wrote:Nooze its broke! o_0
Available on .com
Support Toolkit developer

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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by jsebean » Wed Apr 27, 2011 5:25 pm

all good points so including STK by default would be a no go. What about including some sort of "database cleaner" that would remove mods they want to uninstall and ability to add a new user from the ACP in phpBB 3.2 though. It wouldn't really break the board, if someone runs it to see how it works for the fun of it, all they'd have to do is reinstall the mod and all would be fine again. The purpose of "database cleaner" (and again im not thinking of one exactly like in STK) would be, if you have mods installed that make changes to the database, they usually come with an install file, but you usually delete the install file afterwards (like the phpBB gallery). Then you could undo database changes without having to find the install script the mod came with and uninstall it. It wouldn't necessarly be a database cleaner, but brainstorm on ways to easily uninstall mods from the database.

Then i just think it would be useful to be able to add a new user from the ACP.

Just ideas i havent thought them through too long to really think how they should work though, might not work out too well?
-Jonah

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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by Vinny » Sun May 01, 2011 1:22 am

I always like to insert something already in phpBB 3.0.x.

The comments have convinced me that really would bring more problem that solution. But some tools would be useful to this board, as the "add a new".

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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by Oleg » Sun May 01, 2011 2:05 am

Please start a new topic for adding "add user" feature to the acp.

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Re: [RFC] Include STK by default

Post by Vinny » Sun May 01, 2011 3:22 pm

nn- wrote:Please start a new topic for adding "add user" feature to the acp.
Created: viewtopic.php?f=108&t=38871

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